South Marines Johnson Valley Final EIS-2000 pages of confusion

530ktm

530ktm

Good luck on this one. I started reading some of it and it would take me forever to understand all this crap. Why can't they just say in layman's terms what is going to happen? I did see something about have the Rez Ranch in their sites. :shocked: :P
 
cleonard

cleonard

It's just the EIS. It only seems to cover the alternatives. There is another document to come, the Record of Decision. Usually they come out at the same time so I kind of wonder what's up.

I thought the Marines had balls. Where is the MF-ing ROD? I guess they are testing the waters. ROD expected on 9/28.
 
rezrider

rezrider

Without opening ALL of these docs.. what I learned not too long ago was that it is now up to the Marines to justify ALL of their intentions....
*Measure the economic effect the take over will have on the surrounding areas... From Victorville to Yucca Valley
**Gas
**Grocers/markets
**Restaraunts
**Retail
**ETC...
*What impact it will have on their neighbors (The REZ being one of them)... maybe I'll be getting somethign in the mail!
*Reasons/explanaitions WHY they can't move in other directions other than excuses

There's more, can't think of it at the moment... keep our fingers crossed :cool:
 
cleonard

cleonard

While JV is unchanged, several things have changed with the Marines. First the size of the armed forces is slated to shrink. The reduction for the Marines is 20%. If sequestration kicks in at the beginning of the year, that number will be a 40% reduction on January 1. It is also looking like the Marines will have a reduced role in land warfare in the future.

These things tell me that they can't support a larger base. Just maintaining what they have will be hard enough.
 
530ktm

530ktm

I was just reading some info on my Jeep forum that the Marines have chosen a plan that does not sound very optimistic for any of us. Here is the quote from a well known source.

That I don't know but apparently Option 6 is what the Marines have selected... the worst possible decision for JV offroaders and recreationists.
 
rezrider

rezrider

I think they chose one alternative that was a "partial use" which means once they use it and go thru the pain-staking process of cleaning up "live ordinance" they'll decide that IT ISN'T GOING TO WORK and take ALL of it! not sure that was the option they chose however I think I breifed over something that mentioned a "partial use"... I could be wrong! The only alternative they listed that would benefit the offroad community was to not use any of it at all.... option 8 :noidea:
 
timoyz

timoyz

Nothing has been published as to which plan they are going with. Although, the Marines have already said that the preferred alternative was #6. Alternative #6 would only leave 44% of Johnson Valley open for 10 months out of the year. FURTHER MORE, Alternative #6 has a loophole that could keep it closed to the public for the entire year. **The ’10 month open window’ is subject to a determination by the Commanding General that the area has been returned to a condition suitable for authorized public access following each Marine Expeditionary Brigade Exercise. The “compromise” is that the Marine’s only need two months out of the year to complete the ‘full scale exercise’ therefore 10 months would be open to the public. It is entirely possible that the Commanding General could declare that [due to budgetary constraints] the Military does not have the funds to “return the area to a condition suitable for authorized public access [‘clean up’] therefore leaving the now limited area shut down.
 
rezrider

rezrider

I think they chose one alternative that was a "partial use" which means once they use it and go thru the pain-staking process of cleaning up "live ordinance" they'll decide that IT ISN'T GOING TO WORK and take ALL of it! not sure that was the option they chose however I think I breifed over something that mentioned a "partial use"... I could be wrong! The only alternative they listed that would benefit the offroad community was to not use any of it at all.... option 8 :noidea:

What I said...

Nothing has been published as to which plan they are going with. Although, the Marines have already said that the preferred alternative was #6. Alternative #6 would only leave 44% of Johnson Valley open for 10 months out of the year. FURTHER MORE, Alternative #6 has a loophole that could keep it closed to the public for the entire year. **The ’10 month open window’ is subject to a determination by the Commanding General that the area has been returned to a condition suitable for authorized public access following each Marine Expeditionary Brigade Exercise. The “compromise” is that the Marine’s only need two months out of the year to complete the ‘full scale exercise’ therefore 10 months would be open to the public. It is entirely possible that the Commanding General could declare that [due to budgetary constraints] the Military does not have the funds to “return the area to a condition suitable for authorized public access [‘clean up’] therefore leaving the now limited area shut down.

What he said

I'm thinking we're on the same page.... :( ...... so much for downsizing, budget cronstraints, no need for land op training...... :foul:... I guess we'll at least have a nice airshow once in a while... along with sound effects. :eek:. maybe I'll just become real familiar with RS cyn... and a regular at P & H's... :smirk:
 
timoyz

timoyz

rezrider:
I think they chose one alternative that was a "partial use" which means once they use it and go thru the pain-staking process of cleaning up "live ordinance" they'll decide that IT ISN'T GOING TO WORK and take ALL of it! not sure that was the option they chose however I think I breifed over something that mentioned a "partial use"... I could be wrong! The only alternative they listed that would benefit the offroad community was to not use any of it at all.... option 8 :noidea:

What I said...

Nothing has been published as to which plan they are going with. Although, the Marines have already said that the preferred alternative was #6. Alternative #6 would only leave 44% of Johnson Valley open for 10 months out of the year. FURTHER MORE, Alternative #6 has a loophole that could keep it closed to the public for the entire year. **The ’10 month open window’ is subject to a determination by the Commanding General that the area has been returned to a condition suitable for authorized public access following each Marine Expeditionary Brigade Exercise. The “compromise” is that the Marine’s only need two months out of the year to complete the ‘full scale exercise’ therefore 10 months would be open to the public. It is entirely possible that the Commanding General could declare that [due to budgetary constraints] the Military does not have the funds to “return the area to a condition suitable for authorized public access [‘clean up’] therefore leaving the now limited area shut down.

What he said

I'm thinking we're on the same page.... :( ...... so much for downsizing, budget cronstraints, no need for land op training...... :foul:... I guess we'll at least have a nice airshow once in a while... along with sound effects. :eek:. maybe I'll just become real familiar with RS cyn... and a regular at P & H's... :smirk:
Click to expand...

Alternative #3 is the one we all want. That's the one that goes East, and the no action at all alternative, has no number at all.
 
rezrider

rezrider

timoyz:
Nothing has been published as to which plan they are going with. Although, the Marines have already said that the preferred alternative was #6. Alternative #6 would only leave 44% of Johnson Valley open for 10 months out of the year. FURTHER MORE, Alternative #6 has a loophole that could keep it closed to the public for the entire year. **The ’10 month open window’ is subject to a determination by the Commanding General that the area has been returned to a condition suitable for authorized public access following each Marine Expeditionary Brigade Exercise. The “compromise” is that the Marine’s only need two months out of the year to complete the ‘full scale exercise’ therefore 10 months would be open to the public. It is entirely possible that the Commanding General could declare that [due to budgetary constraints] the Military does not have the funds to “return the area to a condition suitable for authorized public access [‘clean up’] therefore leaving the now limited area shut down.
Click to expand...

A write up in the recent OFF-ROAD.com site says that alternative 6 HAS been chosen and the Navy is in full gear trying to push this thru to conclusion. You will have to read it yourself to understand everything they've noted however it sounds as though the Navy is not following the correct process of hearing all voices, etc..... They also posted the numbers regarding econimc affect which are mind-boggling... $71 million in lost revinue annually in the adjacent areas... As a result of this and according to their report, WE the offroad community will have access to only 20,000 acres of the 160,000+ acres taken ONCE live fire has begun. If I remember correctly that will include the land adjacent to the highway from Boone road (roughly) to Camp Rock road as far into where the Melvin dunes and dry lake are and I'm thinking Soggy DL... beyond that will be off limits. What they (OHV spokespeople) were hoping for was for more time to allow for some "trade offs", options for use...etc. Again you'll have to go to the site (www.off-road.com) to get the details.
 
timoyz

timoyz

rezrider:
A write up in the recent OFF-ROAD.com site says that alternative 6 HAS been chosen and the Navy is in full gear trying to push this thru to conclusion. You will have to read it yourself to understand everything they've noted however it sounds as though the Navy is not following the correct process of hearing all voices, etc..... They also posted the numbers regarding econimc affect which are mind-boggling... $71 million in lost revinue annually in the adjacent areas... As a result of this and according to their report, WE the offroad community will have access to only 20,000 acres of the 160,000+ acres taken ONCE live fire has begun. If I remember correctly that will include the land adjacent to the highway from Boone road (roughly) to Camp Rock road as far into where the Melvin dunes and dry lake are and I'm thinking Soggy DL... beyond that will be off limits. What they (OHV spokespeople) were hoping for was for more time to allow for some "trade offs", options for use...etc. Again you'll have to go to the site (www.off-road.com) to get the details.
Click to expand...

You're probably right, but the official ROD doesn't come out until the end of September, so at that point we can officially plan the poaching of JV.:devil:
 
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